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January 09, 2009

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Karen Kerin

Schools are not too big or too important to fail. Like the auto industry, they should not get another bailout and that is exactly what Act 60/68 really does. We already have a local school tax and the state stepped in to more than sweeten it with the state-wide property tax that is a special benefit, not for the children, but for the vast school bureaucracy. We have a student teacher ratio of 10 to 1 when most states are at 15 to 1. How about a little dose of common sense, eh!

Allan LeBaron

My father, who was a teacher, principal, and superintendent in Vermont schools from 1919 to about 1952, was doubtful, along with most of his cadre, about the educational edicts propounded at the annual meetings of the superintendents, usually by some expert from Columbia Teacher's College but endorsed by Montpelier. Most of his school boards wouldn't even let him hire married teachers when shortages began to show up in 1940-41. Each new educational dispatch from Vermont today enables me to salute him, although I must admit I never thought he was anything special while he was alive. Stubborn, though, which used to be a Vermont virtue. And always very proud of students who did well in later life.

G. Cross

It is fine to have a great debate about how to organize schools, how to evaluate their quality, and more. However, there is one topic that should not be on the table and that is whether every Vermont child has a right to a high quality, equal educataional opportunity. This means that there is no circumstance whereby individual communities can be allowed to return to the time when the haves all had and the have nots did not. Schemes that suggest that there is a base level for all and that the rich towns can provide more if they so desire can not be a part of the discussion. We left that arena years ago!!

Tim

So we spend much more and get average results.
Anyone see what's wrong with this picture?
If labor is 70% of the cost, then you cut labor.
You might even have to have more than 10-15 kids in a classroom.
Administrators?
If you have less staff, you need less management.
Obvious to anyone except the braindead drones running this state.

Richard

G. Cross writes:

"This means that there is no circumstance whereby individual communities can be allowed to return to the time when the haves all had and the have nots did not. Schemes that suggest that there is a base level for all and that the rich towns can provide more if they so desire can not be a part of the discussion. We left that arena years ago!!"

Definition of Utopian Socialism:

"An economic system based on the premise that if capital voluntarily surrendered its ownership of the means of production to the state or the workers, unemployment and poverty would be abolished."

Utopian socialism is what Vermont Businesses for Social Responsibility, Act 60/68 proponents, the seduction of the environmental movement, et al, are aiming for. They are willing to burn down some - if not all - of the village in order to "save it."


Definition of Socialism:

1) "Any of various political philosophies that support social and economic equality, collective decision-making, and public control of productive capital and natural resources, as advocated by socialists."

2) (in Marxist theory) the stage following capitalism in the transition of a society to communism, characterized by the imperfect implementation of collectivist principles.

GreggB

George is right it is not fair. Statewide Elementary schools had a 25% pass rate on the recent science test and my local elementary had a 100% failure rate. To keep everything fair some kids scores need to be changed and not for the better.

Richard

"Utopian socialism" is why these people want to continue to tax and regulate our society, even if it means risking Vermont's economic collapse. It is also why you so often hear their mantra of "if you don't like it here, leave."

They need to export the "unbelievers" and import those who will voluntarily subscribe to the kind of fairness, equity and do-goodism they will impose.

Their ultimate objective is to "cleanse" Vermont of those who do not buy into this dangerous cultural ideology; taxing and regulating the "unbelievers" out in order to create their version of the "perfect society."

G. Cross

It has nothing to do with "utopian socialism" or any form of socialism. It has to do with Vermont law. I can care less about how the funding of edcuation is structured as long as it provides equally across the state. Like it or not, public schools in Vermont are state entities. Roll it all into one, if you want. That will be fine with me. I am just trying to ensure that the state's, not the local's, responsibilities are upheld.

G. Cross

Damn, I just came up with a great idea and need to share it before I forget it. It is an age thing, you know.

I suggest that we abolish all the school districts in the state and create one statewide district. Name Jim Douglas the Superintendent of Schools, name the majority of the posters on this site, excluding this one, as the school board, Curt will be Chairperson of course; and, give them a couple of years to make substantial reductions in the cost of public schools while at the same time dramatically improving student performance. This plan is so simple and so perfect that it can not fail. I cast the first vote for this new and innovative plan

William

William
Part of the answer is to use telepresence higher only the best teachers but let them lecture in more than one school at a time . Let them broadcast from maybe 8 different schools where they are in each class room for 2 week periods and keep rotating thru the school year.

Lazarus Long

This "unbeliever" is trying desperately to move to friendlier climes. Someone please buy my house!

latenac

No one seems to be addressing the elephant in the room as to why teacher to student ratios seem so high and it's called special education. As it is in some districts you have a law suit waiting to happen b/c of lack of funds and teacher to execute EIPs.

Richard

G. Cross,

You and many others are being used as "useful idiots."

Wake up.

G. Cross

Richard,

Thanks for the advice. I will assuredly take it under consideration. However, am glad to learn that I am at least "useful." There cetainly are "idiots" around who are not very useful.

Tim

G. Cross:
You must be part of the ed biz - just trying to keep what you have and get some more, and then hiding behind "it's for the children."

David Usher

The debate has only just begun and already the EdLobby is making foolish statements. Here's one laughable example from a school principal: "I strongly disagree with the governor's conclusion that the financial mess we're in is the fault of the children in Vermont we're trying to educate."

Methinks the NEA has now clamped down on rogue comments and we are soon to be deluged with a campaign to "Save our Schools."

If the NEA was seriously concerned with education, they would support or propose a plan to fix the system, but continual increases in spending is more to their liking.

Perhaps the Legislature will suggest a statewide teachers contract as Ralph Wright suggested many years ago. That would stir the unsustainable pot.

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